Change in the Coalfields: A Podcast by Coalfield Development

Eriks Brolis

March 09, 2023 Coalfield Development Season 3 Episode 8
Change in the Coalfields: A Podcast by Coalfield Development
Eriks Brolis
Show Notes Transcript

Original intro/outro music: 
"'Till I See Stars" by The Parachute Brigade

John F. Kennedy:

The sun does not always shine in West Virginia but the people always do. I'm delighted to be here.

Brandon Dennison:

These are historic times in Appalachia. A lot has changed. A lot is changing now and a lot still needs to change. In our podcast we talked with change makers right square in the middle of all this working to ensure the change is for the good. You're listening to Change in the Coalfields podcast by Coalfield Development. I'm your host Brandon Dennison. Welcome to Change in the Coalfields a podcast by Coalfield Development. I'm Brandon, I'm your host. And this week, we've got Eriks Brolis, Director of the Nature and Economy Program for the West Virginia and Central Appalachian chapter of The Nature Conservancy. So Eriks welcome to the podcast.

Eriks Brolis:

Great. Thanks, Brandon. Really, it's a pleasure to be here.

Brandon Dennison:

Eriks and I've done a lot of work together over the years. And perhaps most importantly, of recent times, Eriks has represented TNC on the ACT Now Coalition, and really leading a lot of our thinking about how to, it's exactly what's in your title, actually, nature and economy, how to bring those two together, how to leverage some of the unique natural assets of central Appalachia, for economic benefit to the local people here. Can you say a little bit more about your role at TNC? And what that vision is for this region?

Eriks Brolis:

Absolutely. Brandon, thanks for the opportunity and might step back just a little bit to kind of give a little bit of perspective on Conservancy. So, you know, we are a global environmental organization, with, you know, a presence looking at everything from how do we tackle climate change to stopping biodiversity loss. And, and so we work both at the global scale, but then have chapters in all 50 states in the US, every Province of Canada. And then we have 72, I believe, country programs at present. So, so we're working, you know, at every level to basically see where we can plug in to stem climate change. And also stop biodiversity loss, we see those as the two biggest threats to not only nature, but also to, you know, humanity and civilization. So we're going to try and figure out how we can do that with both are science at the global scale, and then how we can apply that, you know, with boots on the ground, at the local level. So my role specifically within that is looking at really the intersection of where we can do nature friendly economic diversification, because saving nature for nature's sake. Really, it only takes us so far, right? We really are doing this for making people's lives better. And so here in West Virginia, and the central Appalachian context, we're working to promote four different major work streams, so where we can help transition in the energy economy towards cleaner, renewable sources and cite those appropriately. We're also working to promote outdoor recreation and tourism, so really outdoor recreation in a way that builds on community assets and community values. So you know, making recreation more accessible and making the places here at Appalachian, where we live better. And then we also worked on forest and mine land restoration work. So you know, trying to help kind of use the lands that have already been disturbed, and put those back into either some type of productive reuse or reinforce them for all the benefits that that provides. And then lastly, we promote forest carbon markets. So forest carbon is a way that we can leverage our natural assets to pull the greenhouse gases are, you know, the kind of climate change gases that are that are the pollution, you know, creating the warming of our planet and utilize the wonderful trees and you know, natural acids like I said farmlands and others, to pull that carbon out of the atmosphere and ultimately stem climate change.

Brandon Dennison:

So sometimes in the in the headlines are usually if there's any debate going on nationally about the coal industry, we hear about carbon sequestration technology, but does anything sequester carbon better than a natural

Eriks Brolis:

Natural forests have been doing it for since the forest? beginning of time. As we look at even the geologic history of the Earth, it was really the the growing plants that pulled all of those noxious gases out of the atmosphere and eventually made you know the atmosphere We live in that present what it is today. And amazingly enough, those plants in the early days back when it was still Pangea, single planet, those pulled all those gases out and then ultimately became the coal and fossil resources that were burning today. So it's an interesting kind of, you know, it's very interesting. Yeah, we're now leveraging those natural assets, again, to pull the gases out of the atmosphere and put them back into a livable form.

Brandon Dennison:

And central Appalachia, in some unique and distinctive and important ways. Does this geologically like particularly well, right?

Eriks Brolis:

Yeah. So I mean, as I mentioned, Nature Conservancy is a global organization. As we look at how we can work together to tackle these major goals, and challenges across the world, the organization has determined that we have four focal landscapes. One is the Amazon. One is Kenya. One is Kalimantan, which is in Indonesia, and some of the last really primal forests that are there in that region. And then the fourth is the Appalachians and why the Appalachians are so important is not only because of the really amazing biodiversity that we have here present, but also because of the types of trees, these hardwood forests that are present here in Appalachia, are really critical to not only the climate mitigation, which means, you know, stop it and climate change. But in terms of climate adaptation, and resiliency, the Appalachian chain, which runs from the southeastern part of the country, all the way up into Canada, is really a superhighway for species migration. So you know, in a changing climate, these forests become ever more critical to both help stop climate change, but then allow for both species and people to adapt. And I'll even know I mean, you know, this region provides drinking water to millions and millions of folks across the eastern part of the United States. What I think a lot of folks don't recognize is that, you know, West Virginia has this kind of epicenter where all that water starts up in the high mountains and flows to the east cities like DC, and elsewhere, and then to the west, and eventually into the Mississippi. So, so not only is it a climate, hotspot and a critical place for all the reasons I've just listed, but it's so many more ecosystem services that are being provided that we don't necessarily recognize on a day to day basis.

Brandon Dennison:

You know, and I have to note, unfortunately, I'm in the campus of Marshall University, they let us use the Eye Center podcast studio, which we're very grateful for. And given the train wreck in East Palestine, Ohio, it put a plume in the Ohio River that literally as we speak is like floating past Huntington on the Ohio River. So incredible resources, but resources under threat. And certainly to your point about biodiversity. I noticed one of your four priorities was mine land, sustainable mine land reclamation restoration, I imagine we have this dense forest that captures all this carbon that creates headwaters for drinking water for millions of people. And but it's it's scarred it's a scarred landscape. And, you know, whether you support that industry or not, there's no denying the, if you fly in or out of West Virginia, it's sort of breathtaking, how many of those scars there are on the landscape. So can you say a little bit about why that's one of your top four priorities? And what it could mean, if we could restore those scars to be productive parts of the ecosystem? Again, what would that mean for the planet?

Eriks Brolis:

Yeah, that's a great question. And, you know, I mean, coal has been a critical industry here for this state and also for just the industrialization of America, right? I mean, it's, it's provided the power and the base materials to, you know, to basically build our modern infrastructure, from skyscrapers in New York to basically the warships that you know, won World War II and Brad Smith there at Marshall, obviously, not obviously, the he, he's got a fantastic poem, and I would love to channel him to some extent in terms of just that importance of that industry over time. But times are changing, you know, we're, we're looking at a situation where renewable energy costs have come down to be the most cost competitive resource that's out there. And so you know, that industry is shifting over time. And, you know, the legacy of that industry, like you said, is over a million acres of surface mine lands around the region. And, you know, some of those, those acreages could be reused for different purposes. So, you know, we're looking at where to prioritize solar development on former mine land sites, you know, where we're that, that can basically avoid impacts to forests and agricultural fields elsewhere. So, you know, there's, there's huge opportunities, both economically but environmentally, as well to, you know, to do that type of solar siting. You know, at the same time, we're looking at where there could be reforestation of those islands, and trying to put the trees in the right places to be able to restore these landscapes and create that connectivity that I was speaking to about, you know, kind of what's important for that biodiversity and species migration over time. But also, you know, plant a new tree now, and, you know, in 50 years, you got something that's really one of the most cost effective forms of carbon capture and sequestration that the world has ever known. So all of those different activities that we're trying to promote, kind of are looking at, where we can both kind of reuse those, you know, previously disturbed lands or, you know, put them back into the ecological function that, that they, they served at one point in time, you know, just naturally.

Brandon Dennison:

A key word you mentioned a couple of times is biodiversity. Could you, for listeners who might not be as familiar with that concept, could you explain a little bit more what that is, and why it's so important.

Eriks Brolis:

Happily, and yeah, thanks for making sure you, you can ask me to define any. Because I know, you know, sometimes we get wrapped up in our own kind of scientific, you know, mindset. But, um, biodiversity is just the idea that, you know, there are a lot of different species that are present on the landscape. So biodiversity can be, you know, the complexity of the plants and the plant communities that are located here, all the way up through, you know, kind of the the animals. So, the Appalachians are one of the most biodiverse areas in North America and actually stack up against some of those other global focal places that I was speaking to. And there's, you know, in the Appalachians alone, something like 20,000 different animal species, something like I think 80% of all the freshwater species 10,000 different plant species, and for both nature and humans to thrive over the long term, we need to ensure that there is that biodiversity, you know, just like in our human communities, having a diversity of thought, a diversity of ethnicities, that diversity of perspectives, is something that just makes us stronger over the long term. And it's the same in our natural ecosystems that having different species that fill different niches, that all work together for, you know, for the common good.

Brandon Dennison:

The work you're doing, I mean, the scale of it is, I mean, these are day in, day out. I mean, you're, you're doing your part on some of the very most defining challenges for the planet at this point in time. I imagine that's inspiring, but also overwhelming at different times, and what is it that personally motivates you and brings you to

Eriks Brolis:

It's a fantastic question. And maybe I'll start this work? with, you know, this work is something that the Conservancy is doing, but can't do alone. It's, it's all about doing this work in partnership. And that's, you know, how we try and approach the work is really working with folks like yourself, you know, are, you know, really in the community economic development space and trying to support kind of the broader ecosystem, like I said, of folks and partners that are working to do this all together. So while the Conservancy is trying to set kind of a, you know, the scientific basis for why we're doing what we're doing, and then working together, it really comes down to the network of partners with whom we work to actually get this on, you know, done on the ground, right. And what motivates me circle back to that question is you know, You know, I've had my pessimistic days and my optimistic days. Now that I've got a two and a half year old, like, you know, like, pessimism is not an option, right? Like it's, we have to set an optimistic course and look for solutions to make the world better. I feel like, the more we do that, in honest dialogue, and with pragmatic approaches, that's what really motivates me not getting into one camp or another, philosophically, politically, it's really looking for where there can be human connections. It's just have an honest dialogue about what we need to do, and then find the positive outcome that hopefully, you know, is agreeable, for all involved.

Brandon Dennison:

That's interesting answers, like finding hope and pragmatism might seem counterintuitive, but ultimately, it makes it actually possible. So like that. So where did you grow up Eriks?

Eriks Brolis:

So I grew up in Northern Virginia, and in a, in a, in a time and a place that no longer exists. I grew up not too far outside Washington, DC, and in a place that still hadn't been developed with the high rises and the subdivisions. And I could, I could go find, you know, frogs and snakes and, you know, flip over, you know, logs and see what other bugs were crawling out, you know, at that point in time. And like I said, that, that's no longer than northern Virginia, you know, the, that I, you know, I knew as a child. And, you know, I split time there between Northern Virginia and my grandparents kind of up in the Catskill Mountains, which was, you know, where they, as Latvian immigrants, soon as they had enough money to buy, a couple acres of land moved up and started living off the land, essentially, as homesteaders. So kind of had a bit of a split upbringing with both kind of a reasonably urban, you know, city existence, but then spending summers up, you know, catching 50 frogs, and every summer, you know, kind of tracking, you know, the health of the ecosystem there that my grandparents had created. And then, you know, I'll kind of bring that to the West Virginia context, if I may. But I mean, as soon as I got a driver's license, I was heading west, you know, back in the late 90s, to come explore out in the mountains here. And, you know, long story short, it's after living and working, you know, all across the country and abroad. And kind of looking at where there were the opportunities for both the type of natural lifestyle that we wanted to live, you know, it's going to me and my wife, and also the communities that we wanted to be a part of, it was it was West Virginia, that kind of one, won over our hearts. And we've been here, we've been here for six years.

Brandon Dennison:

That's awesome. We hear so much doom and gloom about population decline in West Virginia, that you're not part of that problem. And investing and putting down roots and raising a family, and that's a beautiful thing.

Eriks Brolis:

Yeah, trying to figure out our niche, you know, the, the existing communities, which are so strong, and a lot of regards here, you know, and need work and where we can lean into also, you know, doing the good work to make those communities stronger.

Brandon Dennison:

That's awesome. Yeah. I mean, in the human sense, we there's people who've been here for generations, and I'm one of them, and I hope that we can stay here, but we've got to have inflow to some some fresh blood and fresh perspectives. And it's back to human diversity, right, the more diverse, more diversity we have of experiences and perspectives and backgrounds and skills, and strengths, the stronger the community we can be.

Eriks Brolis:

Absolutely, yeah, it's, we're living in Davis now. And I can just say, I mean, this community is really at that inflection point. Right, we got, we got my neighbor across the street, you know, retired coal miner. My neighbor here on the other side, is kind of, you know, volunteer extraordinaire, and the Blackwater Bike associations, but help him build out a lot of the trail network here. You know, we've got to landfill you know, a mile in front of me in a coal mine, and a coal power plant, you know, 10 miles down the room. And then behind me, we got, you know, 40,000 plus acres a wilderness area that are attracting 10s of 1000s of visitors, and has some of the most expensive real estate in the state. You know, in Canaan Valley, so it's really an interesting kind of intersection of all of the different shifts that are underway.

Brandon Dennison:

We don't want the inflow, we don't want the gentrification, right.

Eriks Brolis:

That's the really important piece of that, yeah, is that it's got to be done in a way to not displace, I think local, like if folks come in, and what I personally strive for, is to find a way, like I said, to fill a new niche in a community, but not displace all of the values and community, kind of the history and, and depth of kind of experience that, you know, the multi generational families provide here. And that's why we like to be here. We, it's because of those deep roots and family values that makes it something that is a place I'm excited to raise my daughter.

Brandon Dennison:

I would love to hear a brief tangent on the, say, the Latvian immigrant experience and just some of the story, just I would love to hear a little bit of that piece of your family story.

Eriks Brolis:

Yeah. It's a big piece of my family's story. Actually, I'm both my parents are of Latvian heritage. My dad's actually half Latvian, half Estonian. And, and my grandparents, as young folks with young children in tow, you know, had to flee Eastern Europe after World War II, because of the the Soviet occupation, they're of Eastern Europe. And so, so they fled in the 50s, and spent almost five years and what are essentially displaced persons camps or refugee camps in Germany, before getting sponsorship to come to this country. And, and so I, you know, I grew up hearing stories of, you know, the war from that perspective, but also, you know, of the relocation. And what I think Latvians did really well in coming to this country was really, you know, resting on their cultural heritage and building cultural institutions and churches and really utilizing those community networks for the community as a whole to both continue the cultural traditions, but also help each other economically through, you know, getting jobs and getting situated. And so even to this day, like my wife and I, we met at a Latvian high school camp in Michigan. And so she too, was Latvian. And we are raising our daughter to speak some form of Latvian, might not be as perfect as what came over with my grandparents, but we are trying to continue those cultural traditions and kind of honor that, while also, you know, being like I said, integrated into the kind of the communities that we are a part of now here. And, you know, again, another maybe side note on that is just as folks, you know, see my name or, you know, kind of your this Latvian heritage, it's, it's interesting to hear of a lot of the Eastern European immigrants that came to work in that are part of those multigenerational families that have been here. So you know, Slovenia, and Slovakia, and you know, that those are, those are families that have been here, you know, that came, were picked up basically in the Port of Baltimore, to come work out in the coal mines or in the timber industry, you know, 100 plus years ago.

Brandon Dennison:

And so, so a piece of the American story in the Appalachian story, yep.

Eriks Brolis:

Yeah. It's deeply woven, and it's always pleasant to kind of feel those connections even across generations and, you know, across space and time.

Brandon Dennison:

I imagine you and your friends and your family from that community are keeping a close eye on the situation in

Eriks Brolis:

We certainly are. Yeah, it's it's a first time I Ukraine. ever feel like I saw the plight of my grandparents in real time. Like I have like I said, I heard the stories. But watching you know, that Ukrainian invasion was basically like seeing a broadcast from 70 years ago or 75 years ago when when they had to flee their country and pack up and you know, fight to get spots on a train and you know, or boat or whatever way to get out of the country. So we're, we're watching that closely. And you know, the Eastern Latvia, which is an independent Republican President, you know, has really similar conditions as the Ukraine and Russia has similar interests there. So it's, you know, should Ukraine fall I think that we're gonna see more of Eastern Europe be impacted in the same way and so yeah, it's a it's a very real situation and, and ties a lot into the work that we're doing here. You know, the energy transition is so important. You know, making energy costs affordable and like its...

Brandon Dennison:

Energies at an intersection with that whole situation is could we hear a couple sentences in Latvian, what's that? What does that language sound like?

Eriks Brolis:

What would you like me to say? I'll say whatever you want me to.

Brandon Dennison:

Explain the biodiversity of central Appalachia.

Eriks Brolis:

You're gonna make me challenge my Latvian grammar but...

Brandon Dennison:

Just tell us about your family. No, of

Eriks Brolis:

Of course yeah.(Speaks in Latvian)

Brandon Dennison:

What a beautiful language. Thank you for that.

Eriks Brolis:

I hope no Latvian speakers are gonna have a bunch of hooey.

Brandon Dennison:

So, Eriks, you're professionally, so you mentioned you get a driver's license, you spend a lot of time and and I assume you're talking about like the Monongahela National Forest? By and large.

Eriks Brolis:

by and large? Yep. Yeah, kind of up and down on the Allegheny front. So a lot of trips up to Dolly Sods. And my first lead climbing was up Seneca Rocks, dragging my brother up on a snowy day in January, and it's rock climbing, and then, you know, more. So now, you know, hunting and fishing and, you know, really kind of getting as an adult onset hunter, you know, learning how to not only, you know, take an animal respectfully, but also then process it down and feed my family with it. So we've got a whole diversity of recreational opportunities that, you know, I wouldn't try and use all of them, or experience and, you know, at least participate in all of them. To the extent that again.

Brandon Dennison:

Did you know, from a young age that this is the kind of work you wanted to do? Or does it take a while to land where you are?

Eriks Brolis:

Yeah, that's a good question. A lot of different things in my life. So I, you know, my father was a contractor, you know, carpenter, and so I grew up swinging a hammer with him, and definitely fed myself and, you know, helps kind of pay for adventures by by doing that work, you know, in between breaks at school, and, you know, over the summer. And then, you know, that kind of transition into renewable energy work, you know, chased the early days of the renewable energy market out to Colorado back in the mid 2000s. And then, you know, ultimately, you know, kind of the, the common theme is, you know, coming out of college, it was the first glimpses that I had, you know, the pending, or kind of impending climate crisis. And so, you know, since that time, you know, the work has really centered around and, you know, my motivation has been around, like, where do we find pragmatic, business based solutions to mitigating the climate crisis? And so that, maybe not at an early age, but, you know, there's some kind of beacon of light that's always been there towards kind of how we use nature, you know, kind of, but, you know, include people's benefits and outcomes. You know, like I said, have a business based way or a community based way to really make that happen.

Brandon Dennison:

What did you learn out in Colorado? Which I know is a very broad question, but now, solar, wind, geothermal, it's becoming like a fact of reality, like, now, it's like, of course, that's in the conversation about energy in the early 2000s. That was not necessarily the case. I mean, there were major skepticism about if solar would ever be a viable component. Energy System. What did you learn out there and how has that carried forward and some of the creative problem solving you do today?

Eriks Brolis:

Yeah, that is a big question. I learned a lot and it was very formative time in my life and, you know, moved out kind of in my mid 20s. And I was there, you know, into my kind of mid 30s, early 30s. And I think, you know, on the broad scale, it really was a time to recognize how dynamic the world is and how dynamic life is, in a sense. Like, from when I moved there to what I left, I mean, the community shifted, you know, lots of people moved in, real estate started to go gangbusters to the point that it became unaffordable for most folks to live in places like the front range of Colorado, it was really that inflection point. And then, you know, kind of on the, the climate front, it also went from, you know, having a pretty defined fire season two, one that was a year round fire season that, you know, you never knew when those forests were going to burn, and, you know, dynamic in the sense that, you know, how fickle nature can be, too, and how those tipping points, you know, can really happen in a relatively short period of time. And then on the energy front, yeah, like the shift between, you mentioned kind of the solar and at that time, like it was just kind of an environmentalists cause to go solar, right, like it was solar was the green enviro thing to do. And again, over that period of time, the cost of solar fell precipitously, I mean, because the economies of scale are starting to get built, and all of a sudden went from the feel good, do good, kind of early adopter solar kind of installer purchaser to one that, you know, to the time that solar was being deployed, because it was the most cost effective way to generate power. And so that that whole shifts was underway. And like I said, it was, you know, from like, the mid 2000s, to the mid 20-teens. You know, that really was this major shift in, you know, how we generate energy, how we can generate energy, the cost, relative costs of, you know, that energy generation, you know, between different resources. And so, you know, I think those are just those big themes. It feels like that was a kind of knee of the curve as we're accelerate really...

Brandon Dennison:

At the cutting edge there. Yeah, sort of that liminal moment. Now you're at the cutting edge of changes in Appalachia. So I'm curious if you could reflect, you know, what are some of the biggest changes you've already seen? Since you've been focused on this region professionally? And as a West Virginia resident, and what are some of the big changes you've not seen yet, but you hope to see soon?

Eriks Brolis:

You know, haven't been here now, six years, I feel like we're at a similar inflection point in the state that I was just describing what happened in Colorado, where folks are moving in, you know, that, that there, there's more of a community here, you know, there's a lot of young families around us, you know, both multigenerational folks that have been here, but also, you know, young folks that have come from elsewhere. So I think that, that those changes that I described, are, are afoot, here in the state, and it's not necessarily in every community across the state, you know, it's definitely you know, pocketed in particular regions that are leveraging their natural assets to to make those shifts occur. So I would say that the changes I've seen is that we are, we've got places like bright spots of population growth, we got bright spots that are really, you know, figuring out new ways to leverage those natural assets, you know, to the community benefit, we're seeing that shift in energy costs to that. I mean, they're, you know, it's arguable that new solar generation resources are cheaper to operate to build and operate than to operate existing fossil fuel facilities. And so that's a tipping point. Yeah, the economics are just, you know, are really changing here super quickly. And, you know, that's, that's absent, even, you know, the federal incentives that have now been put into place to help accelerate that transition for energy communities. So, so I think the changes that are afoot that I'd still like to see is, I think, maybe a recognition that you know, a lot of the traditional values can be upheld, and you know, West Virginia is critical role in everything from provisioning water, to our streams to, you know, to provide drinking water to millions of people across to, you know, continuing to serve as an energy powerhouse, right, like, like it's a it's a different set of resources. But we have those available to us here too, that West Virginia can continue to basically help power the nation to be a better and better place. And so I feel like that's the major change that I like to see is kind of embracing the fact that, yeah, maybe it's not a pride in kind of all the hard work that folks have had to do in coal and timber and other critical industries to the state. But, you know, there's a whole new set of opportunities that we can continue to, yeah, to utilize the strength of the communities and the grit and resilience of the community members towards, you know, really serving not only West Virginia, but what we have always done, which is, you know, surrounding states and the rest of the country.

Brandon Dennison:

That's such an awesome vision. And it's such an empowering vision, you know, instead of saying, West Virginia is this place with all these problems, we got to fix. Like, you're you just flip that you're saying West Virginia is this amazing place with strong people, and phenomenal resources that can contribute to solving our country's problems and our world's problems?

Eriks Brolis:

Absolutely. And I mean, it's leaders like yourself, Brandon, you know, really are helping set that course. And, you know, again, find pragmatic optimism for where we can look towards the future. And really double down on the people and, you know, kind of communities and the surrounding nature, and, you know, the kids are all included all the, you know, all our data, right? That's, that's part of the community here. So, yeah.

Brandon Dennison:

Well, it's, it's a lot of fun. It's very rewarding, collaborating with you with The Nature Conservancy. And again, just empowering to know that this global organization has, you know, consider Central Appalachia to be as important as the Amazon in the fight against climate change. I just find that empowering and inspiring, and appreciate everything that you bring to this work to the act now coalition, and excited for many more years of collaboration.

Eriks Brolis:

Right back at Brandon. West Virginia chapter is the smallest chapter in our global organization spots. We've got the resources potentially the knowledge resources - yeah, we really like to need to work in partnership with leaders like yourself and the other members of the Act Now Coalition to really translate, you know, global the ground or ground and global goes both directions.

Brandon Dennison:

All about the collaboration. All right, keep it up. And thank you.

Eriks Brolis:

Thank you, Brandon.

Brandon Dennison:

Change in the Coalfields is a podcast created by Coalfield Development in the hills and hollers of West Virginia. This episode was hosted by Brandon Dennison, and produced and edited by JJN Multimedia become a part of our mission to rebuild the Appalachian economy by going to our website Coalfield-Development.org. To make a donation, you can email us anytime at info at Coalfield-Development.org and subscribe to our newsletter for more information on the podcast. You can follow us on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook and LinkedIn by searching Coalfield Development. Check back soon for more episodes.